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davos
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 18:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

This feature was implemented some time ago on the Dutch version of this site: when both players pass, both players get to see a score count in the confirmation phase where you can mark dead stones. Bot players can decide to continue playing if the score displayed is not what they expected.
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Zapmeister
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 0:59    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very few games of go should actually finishing by passing and scoring. It's usually not hard to see who is going to win before you reach that point, and one player should simply resign as soon as the result is clear.

When you do need to play right to the end, just close all the gaps.
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jaredhayter
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 19:26    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zapmeister wrote:
Very few games of go should actually finishing by passing and scoring. It's usually not hard to see who is going to win before you reach that point, and one player should simply resign as soon as the result is clear.

When you do need to play right to the end, just close all the gaps.


With all due respect to a more experienced player, your attitude may reflect go player culture but not game player culture in general. We're not really part of go society here nor should we necessarily be bound be the ethics of go players. I wouldn't expect my opponent to resign because he was losing in any other game and I'm not sure I should expect it in when playing go. If I had resigned every game in which I was losing I don't think I would have gotten better at any game I've ever played. Letting a weaker player finish a game to his own satisfaction is something you agree to by starting a game. If you want to play by a different set of standards that is something about which you should be explicit at the outset.

Also, the fact that large areas of the board can be scored incorrectly by the auto-scorer suggests to me that they could still go either way based player performance. If stones are not marked dead it suggests that they might still gain life in which case it seems to me that both players should continue until those groups are decided regardless of whether it will change the final outcome of the game. A learning player needs to learn how to minimize loss through fighting and tactics before he can start learning how to gain territory.
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Zapmeister
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 4:15    Post subject: Reply with quote

The nature of the game of go (in particular, the difficulty in defining the end of the game) is the reason that the practices commonly used when playing have evolved as they have. If players insist on not resigning then go, by its nature, is a very long and tedious game.

I agree that this site is not really suited to to go, and that's been an ongoing discussion in this forum for some time. Specifically, if you want to learn how to play go, this site is definitely not the place to do it.

Read the topic "teacher" in this forum for some good advice on how to start learning this game.
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jaredhayter
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2012 14:29    Post subject: long and tedious Reply with quote

It seems that the tedium of playing out the endgame to each player's satisfaction could be solved by introducing the 9x9 board and recommending it for beginners. It would allow them to play out every situation to it's bitter end and help them to read life and death. Games would be over in 40 moves or less even if played out until all possible stones are loaded onto the board. Peter Shotwell actually recommends this learning method in his book Beginning Go. He starts players out scoring by stone counting which gives players the opportunity to prove the life or death status of every group on the board.
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davos
PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 21:03    Post subject: Re: long and tedious Reply with quote

jaredhayter wrote:
It seems that the tedium of playing out the endgame to each player's satisfaction could be solved by introducing the 9x9 board and recommending it for beginners. It would allow them to play out every situation to it's bitter end and help them to read life and death. Games would be over in 40 moves or less even if played out until all possible stones are loaded onto the board. Peter Shotwell actually recommends this learning method in his book Beginning Go. He starts players out scoring by stone counting which gives players the opportunity to prove the life or death status of every group on the board.


True, 9x9 would benefit new players. But still, some will manage to take two months to play one 9x9 game on a turn based site (which would take only take 20 minutes in real life), learning very, very slowly.
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