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Eye-q
PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:56    Post subject: The "h" tile value Reply with quote

Hello everybody. I am glad that I am a member of this community and I' ve been playing a year and 2 months now (mostly wordgame, backgammon and chess). I want to start a conversation regarding the "h" tile use in the game, which - to my point of view - is problematic and should be changed. And I thing it should be changed in 2 ways. First the number of "h" tiles. 6?! I think 2-4 should be quite enough. Second the tile value. Just 1 point when "scrabble" - for example - gives you 4. I have found myself in a very frustrating situation having 4 "h" tiles in my rack and I have two simultaneous problems: It is very hard to use them and when I use them I get very low points. Thank you for your time reading this. I do not know if this can be fixed. If it can I 'll be very glad. If not ... at least I tried! Continue enjoying playing out there!
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labradors
PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 14:16    Post subject: Reply with quote

It appears the frequency and value of the letters may have been based upon Dutch letter frequency, rather than English letter frequency and/or the Dutch version of Scrabble. Actually, it seems to be some kind of compromised between the two, since it doesn't truly reflect the standard, accepted letter frequencies used for cryptographic analysis of either language.

The H is particularly puzzling. The Dutch and English versions of Scrabble have two of them, valued at four points each. German has four of them (older sets, five), valued at two points each, while Irish has a whopping TEN of them, valued at one point each. None of that could account for the lower-than-usual valuation and higher-than-normal frequency of having six H tiles valued at only one point each.

As the original poster stated, I, too, often wind up with three or four of them in my rack. In fact, I often receive two or three in a single turn's letter draw and that happens far more often than one would expect from truly random chance - something that also hints at flaws within the site's pseudo-random generator used for choosing the tiles to be drawn. It would appear the game may be using rand() instead of the more-random (and four-times faster) mt_rand(). That should probably be a separate topic from that of the excessive H tiles, but it IS a factor that, especially when combined with the frequency of the H tiles, DOES affect play.
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BrendaOffline
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Uk
PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2011 23:17    Post subject: too many H's....... Reply with quote

I too have often ended up with 3 or 4 H tiles on my rack - and it really can be frustrating! But then there are many idiosyncrasies in this game - like the word ZOO not being accepted when other more obvious abreviations are. But I guess the same rules affect everyone equally. But if there were to be a referendum on the subject, I would definitely vote for the letter 'H' to have a higher score!
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tpfnat
PostPosted: Wed May 04, 2011 11:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

I second a higher value
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tpfnat
PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2011 10:52    Post subject: Reply with quote

no reaction on the value or amount from an admin?
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Eye-q
PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2011 11:35    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you tpfnat! Thank you very much. My point exactly. This post is almost two weeks old and no admin has even bother to make a comment. But ... wait. Why an admin bother to post anything here? 81 people have read this post and only 3 (!) wrote their opinion. So, if I try to "interpet" admin's mind, why change a rule that the players don't care about? Anyway. I started this post because I thought that the "h" tile was annoying not only to me but to several other players and it seems that it is not. Labradors posted a great comment with statistic arguments on the same day and I thought that it was a great start for us to actually change something. Perhaps I was wrong. Spread the word when you play that we need more reactions on this post and maybe something can be done in the end.
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imphic
PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2011 11:00    Post subject: Reply with quote

I also support reducing the amount and increasing the value, though it seems to mostly be my opponents that run into the having too many "h" tiles problem.
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radarcheryl07
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Usa
PostPosted: Sun May 15, 2011 17:01    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree there are too many H's. Why not take away a couple and add another vowel to 2 of the vowels?
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bramOffline
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Netherlands
PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 8:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

Done.. 3 h's remove, added an a, o, i.
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tpfnat
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 20:32    Post subject: Reply with quote

nice work Very Happy
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labradors
PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2011 18:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, Bram. I had forgotten about this thread, but noticed that I haven't been cluster-bombed with H tiles recently. Now I see why.

Thanks again!
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Eye-q
PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2011 22:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Bram! I am sorry I did not find time to thank you earlier but I had no time to check the post. I also want to thank every member who supported this post. Keep "wordgaming"!
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bchandler
PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 1:34    Post subject: Reply with quote

so THIS explains why when i was counting letters for an endgame recently, there was a weird discrepancy between the letters listed on the tips and tricks page, and what i was counting. I threw away the paper, but i think it had something to do with there being either more or less h's than listed. and yeah, the zoo thing has annoyed me several times. I have to imagine there has to be some newer open sorce word list we can use, like maybe wikitionary or something.
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bramOffline
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Netherlands
PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 10:10    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently the old letter distribution was still used when you got new letters in the game after 2 passes.

I fixed that as well. Thanks to Brenda for bringing it to our attention.
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